Unit duration, what happened?


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Frank & Stein
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Message 7261 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 15:13:20 UTC

    What happened? Since work became available, the units are showing really short estimated times but I have yet to finish one. BOINC shows estimated time of ~3 minutes, I\'m over 9 hours on a 2.66 GHz Xeon with a unit and only ~55% done.

    If this holds, there is no way I\'ll get all the units done that downloaded.

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    Message 7262 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 15:54:21 UTC

      I have the same thing happening. Looks like about 60 work units estimated about 4 minutes each. I have one running now been running 58 minutes, and 5.5% complete. If that keeps up, will take 17.5 hours to complete. At that rate the 60 work units will require over 1000 hours, or 44 days. Will keep watching.
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      Message 7264 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 16:08:05 UTC

        I\'m having about 10 WU\'s with an estimated runtime of 7 minutes each. My 2.2GHz E4500 worked for nearly 5 hours and the first WU has a progress of 2%.

        Does the new BOINC version 6.2.18 bring in problems here or is it SZTAKI Desktop Grid.

        WU\'s from other projects like SETI, LHC, Einstein and Leiden are behaving normal.
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        Message 7265 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 16:27:23 UTC

          It\'s not BOINC. I suspended all but one unit to see what will happen on one machine. Another machine, currently inaccessible, is cranking away on more. One of the suspended units had over 8 hours with less than 10% complete. The unit still running is now over ten hours and continues to progress, albeit very slowly.

          I\'ll be back when this unit finishes and/or I can get a gander at my other machine.

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          Message 7266 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 19:55:09 UTC

            I think the switch from the 12th dimension to the 13th causes the problem.
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            Message 7267 - Posted 10 Sep 2008 23:10:24 UTC

              Yeah, my poor old computer has 0.5 percent complete at nearly 2 hours of work. At this rate I doubt I could finish by the deadline 2 weeks from now.

              robert spry
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              Message 7268 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 0:03:24 UTC

                Oh MY... I\'m slowed down to a crawl and 15 hrs compleasted yet the hours to compleation has kept on increasing...
                This is NUTS.

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                Message 7269 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 6:13:41 UTC - in response to Message 7266.

                  I think the switch from the 12th dimension to the 13th causes the problem.

                  Exactly. This problem the very same like the 11th->12th dimension change.
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                  hape
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                  Message 7271 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 8:07:01 UTC

                    The WU\'s are getting slower and slower:

                    WU 1: 0.4% in 9 minutes
                    WU 2: 3.0% in 5 hours and 48 minutes
                    WU 3: 4.9% in 12 hours

                    I have a total of 24 WU on my system, all of them are due in two weeks.
                    I will suspend all of them - this does not make sense

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                    Message 7273 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 10:18:24 UTC

                      Last modified: 11 Sep 2008 10:42:16 UTC

                      I have one here which has 1 day of CPU, just passed the 20% mark.

                      I\'d hate to see the points go down the drain by aborting it, but if these WU\'s are faulty and withdrawn, that is what will happen I suppose.

                      Let\'s at least hope we get some answer to this, and soon!

                      EDIT : Hmmm, this thread was started almost a day ago and no reaction. Looks like we can forget about the \"soon\". After all, why would an admin at least state that they are working on this, it\'s only people volunteering their CPU to the project who are getting frustrated. No big deal.

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                      Message 7274 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 12:48:04 UTC

                        So Disappointing that ADMINs do not respond to the problems being reported. Even an acknowledgement would have been appreciated. But alas... time to abort these ridicules # of WUs that just don\'t seem to be working correctly.

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                        Message 7275 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 15:29:06 UTC

                          Still running. One workunit the looked like it should complete in 17.5 hours, is still running 22 hours in and only 78% complete.

                          I temperorially suspended the other projects to try and get a reading on completion time, which does not look like any time soon. When I counted, I have 80 of there workunits. Looks like I will have to abort most of them, since there is no way to finish them in time, and I will be returning this machine to its requaler project processing shortly.
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                          Message 7277 - Posted 11 Sep 2008 21:09:09 UTC - in response to Message 7274.

                            So Disappointing that ADMINs do not respond to the problems being reported. Even an acknowledgement would have been appreciated. But alas... time to abort these ridicules # of WUs that just don\'t seem to be working correctly.



                            I\'ve written a privat message to the ADMIN - hope this helps
                            In the meantime all my SZTAKI WU\'s are suspended. This way I don\'t get new ones and the other BOINC projects can do some useful work.
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                            Frank & Stein
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                            Message 7280 - Posted 12 Sep 2008 11:31:17 UTC

                              ~156,000 seconds and my first unit is complete. That\'s just a wee bit longer than old units used to take. Wonder how long it\'ll take to reach a quorum?

                              Sztaki suspended on my machines for a bit.

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                              Message 7281 - Posted 12 Sep 2008 12:43:09 UTC - in response to Message 7280.

                                I have the same problem. I\'ve received 100+ tasks which it is necessary to send till September, 24th. When I received them, each task demanded less than 4 minutes, but for 2 hours only 3.5 % of one task have been counted up. What I have to do in this situation?

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                                Message 7282 - Posted 12 Sep 2008 14:17:22 UTC

                                  Well, most of us suspend the project and wait for a response from the admin here, suggest you do the same. It seems useless to leave them running currently, as it\'ll probably not get validated since other users suspend/abort.
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                                  Message 7283 - Posted 12 Sep 2008 16:58:05 UTC - in response to Message 7282.

                                    Well, most of us suspend the project and wait for a response from the admin here, suggest you do the same. It seems useless to leave them running currently, as it\'ll probably not get validated since other users suspend/abort.


                                    Agreed. I have aborted all but two units. One is finished, the other already had 10 hours in, so I\'ve decided to let it also complete. The other ~100 are toast, as they would have disrupted other projects and many would not have completed in time anyway.

                                    Personally I can live with 100 hour units, if I know they are coming, and just importantly if BOINC knows they are coming so they don\'t screw up other projects.

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                                    Message 7284 - Posted 12 Sep 2008 17:08:54 UTC

                                      Agreed. Long units are no problem as long as they are marked as such. If not, they\'ll screw up the entire scheduling mechanism of BOINC.

                                      As it is, there\'s NO WAY people will finish most of the units here, some people got 10+ units, all to finish within 2 weeks, where every unit would take 100 hours or so.

                                      Something is f*cked up big time, and needs to be addressed. It is a shame that the one(s) who should address this, take so long to respond. The detach button starts to be a reasonable alternative, sadly.
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                                      Aurora Borealis
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                                      Message 7287 - Posted 14 Sep 2008 13:37:32 UTC

                                        Last modified: 14 Sep 2008 13:50:06 UTC

                                        Same story here. Initial estimated run time of 7:52 min. I\'m 79.36 hrs into the first one with 83.8% done. I calculate that the final run time will be around 95 hrs. A second WU seems to be running even longer. With 16:32 hrs in it\'s only at 8.1% which at the moment works out to something like 160 hrs to completion.

                                        I limited work from almost all other project as soon as I noticed the ton of WU downloaded and that the completion estimates were way off. I wanted to get through the first WU as quickly as possible and get a better feel of exactly what is going on here. This is only the second time a project has forced me to help Boinc make deadline. I normally allow Boinc to do its own thing and don\'t spend a lot of time watching individual projects. I hate having to micromanage since it tend to frak up Boinc project management.

                                        A check of DCF (Duration Correction Factor) for this project shows it at 45. This indicates to me that this project has a habit of low balling its estimates. My guess is that after the first WU competes the DCF will be in the thousands.

                                        I\'ll be aborting about 80 WU in the next 24/48 hrs, turning my other projects back on and returning to set and forget mode. With all the extra time this project as been eating up in the past week, I suspect that Boinc wont be asking for new work from it for some time.

                                        The managers of this project need to get their act together. Adjust their estimates and increase the due dates for these WUs.

                                        Edit: I don\'t detach from projects, but I have been known to lower their resource share to a very low percentage until they do a better job of managing it.
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                                        Message 7288 - Posted 14 Sep 2008 20:35:37 UTC - in response to Message 7261.

                                          Hi Everyone,

                                          due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                          However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.

                                          ==Adam

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                                          Message 7291 - Posted 14 Sep 2008 23:52:26 UTC

                                            My dual-G5 Mac got through one of the new tasks, which BOINC had estimated at just over five minutes each—much shorter than the usual, so it downloaded the maximum—in about 56 hours. I’ll see how the next couple go, “high priority” of course, but it looks like I’ll be aborting at least 90% of them. If I give the project all of this host’s CPU-time for the next ten days or so (it normally gets around 10%), based on the current estimates I might get through ten tasks by the deadline …

                                            Coming off a period of no work, everyone’s client will have eagerly download a cacheful all at once. And it seems that the estimates on the previous tasks were too high*, compounding the problem: this host’s DCF was at 0.086, but now that I’ve reported the new result, it’s rocketed to 57, nearly a seven-hundredfold increase.

                                            * For the PPC Mac platform, anyway. Anyone else seeing such a large factor? The first couple of posts in this thread imply three- or four-hundredfold increases for Wintel. Then again, in context a mere factor of two somehow doesn’t seem very significant!
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                                            Message 7294 - Posted 15 Sep 2008 8:31:12 UTC - in response to Message 7288.

                                              Hi Everyone,

                                              due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.
                                              Hi,
                                              Thank you for your reply.
                                              You forgot one thing: there are other projects we are participating in. According to my project\'s resource sharing I doubt many of my computers can finish more than one WU (if ever could!) before the deadline unless I stop other projects. But I wouldn\'t do this because of their workunits which have their own deadlines!
                                              Therefore I have aborted all but currently running SZTAKI DG units on all my computers.
                                              2+ hours of micromanagement... I hate this! :(
                                              However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.
                                              Problem is in poor computing time prediction. 100+ hours instead of 4+ minutes are two big differences!
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                                              Message 7297 - Posted 15 Sep 2008 10:45:25 UTC

                                                Last modified: 15 Sep 2008 11:27:48 UTC

                                                Thanks for the update, Adam. I have resumed the project and will finish the Wu\'s I have. I sure hope you can take care of the estimated duration problem, as this makes a huge mess of BOINC\'s scheduling (i.e. all SZTAKI WU\'s become high priority, so no other projects run. Due to these projects having their own deadlines, they in turn become high priority as well, and in the end ALL WU\'s start missing deadlines, not just the SZTAKI ones... :-( ). So untill this is fixed, I will make sure I get only one SZTAKI WU at a time.

                                                EDIT : Perhaps a post on the frontpage news would be in order to let everybody know NOT to abort the units?
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                                                Message 7300 - Posted 15 Sep 2008 13:06:38 UTC - in response to Message 7291.

                                                  this host’s DCF was at 0.086, but now that I’ve reported the new result, it’s rocketed to 57, nearly a seven-hundredfold increase.


                                                  I\'ve never previously paid attention to how the estimated time to completion gets calculated. I do not know what my original DCF was on my machines. I do know this: My 2.66 Xeon rig has finished two units, and the DCF is now 100. I let it download one new unit, and the estimated time to completion is ~150 hours. My ~2.7 GHz quad has not yet finished a unit. I did let it download five. Its DCF is 1 and the estimated time to completion is also very low.

                                                  I gather that once one of these monster units completes on a given machine, the DCF will be updated and future estimates for time to completion will be fine. No?

                                                  Hadak Utja
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                                                  Message 7301 - Posted 15 Sep 2008 13:11:24 UTC

                                                    I am experiencing the same issue. I have 25 WUs to complete, all of them has an indicated completion time 8 min 55 sec. I have one completed under 8 min 41 sec, I am working on another one for 73 hours now and it is still 8,1% complete, an another one is at 10,2% after 5 hours 40 min. I am pretty sure with these speed I will not be able to complete them, but would be really disappointed to see 100 hours of work wasted.

                                                    Does anyone is working on this issue in SZTAKI?
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                                                    Message 7304 - Posted 15 Sep 2008 15:06:08 UTC - in response to Message 7301.

                                                      I am experiencing the same issue. I have 25 WUs to complete, all of them has an indicated completion time 8 min 55 sec. I have one completed under 8 min 41 sec, I am working on another one for 73 hours now and it is still 8,1% complete, an another one is at 10,2% after 5 hours 40 min. I am pretty sure with these speed I will not be able to complete them, but would be really disappointed to see 100 hours of work wasted.

                                                      Does anyone is working on this issue in SZTAKI?


                                                      The admin (Adam) is aware of all this, and looking into it. For now, I would suggest aborting the WU\'s that have NOT started yet. Will not cost you any hours of work, and they will in time be re-issued to another machine. Let one WU per machine finish, so the estimate of future SZTAKI WU\'s will be much closer to the actual required runtime. From then on, business as usual.

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                                                      Message 7308 - Posted 16 Sep 2008 17:14:03 UTC - in response to Message 7288.

                                                        Last modified: 16 Sep 2008 17:30:35 UTC

                                                        Since these WU\'s are taking much much longer than the initial time estimates, are they also likely to encounter Maximum CPU Time Exceeded errors? If so, can we those avoid errors by editing anything in our client_state files? For example, increasing <rsc_fpops_est> and/or <rsc_fpops_bound> ?

                                                        EDIT: I would also like to remind everyone that, in this case, deadlines don\'t mean very much. That is, as long as your result is returned before a quorum is reached, it will still be considered. In this situation, nearly all results will be late. Therefore, it will take quorums a long long time to form.

                                                        Hi Everyone,

                                                        due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                        However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.

                                                        ==Adam


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                                                        Message 7310 - Posted 16 Sep 2008 20:08:33 UTC - in response to Message 7308.

                                                          Last modified: 16 Sep 2008 20:13:55 UTC

                                                          Since these WU\'s are taking much much longer than the initial time estimates, are they also likely to encounter Maximum CPU Time Exceeded errors? If so, can we those avoid errors by editing anything in our client_state files? For example, increasing <rsc_fpops_est> and/or <rsc_fpops_bound> ?

                                                          Yes, I have one already:
                                                          16/09/2008 17:41:21|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2: exceeded CPU time limit 340640.410044
                                                          16/09/2008 17:41:26|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Computation for task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2 finished
                                                          16/09/2008 17:41:26|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Output file 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2_0 for task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2 absent
                                                          16/09/2008 17:41:26|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Output file 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2_1 for task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2 absent

                                                          I am pretty sure it will be so with almost all of my new SZTAKI WUs. What a waste of the time!
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                                                          Message 7311 - Posted 17 Sep 2008 11:15:02 UTC

                                                            16/09/2008 17:41:21|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2: exceeded CPU time limit 340640.410044


                                                            Are you telling me these work units are going to bomb out after 94.5 hours (~340k seconds) regardless? I\'ve got two running which are going to take closer to 250 hours to complete as they are...
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                                                            Message 7313 - Posted 17 Sep 2008 14:00:50 UTC - in response to Message 7311.

                                                              16/09/2008 17:41:21|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2: exceeded CPU time limit 340640.410044


                                                              Are you telling me these work units are going to bomb out after 94.5 hours (~340k seconds) regardless? I\'ve got two running which are going to take closer to 250 hours to complete as they are...


                                                              If I take the rsc_bound_fpops of a WU, and divide this by my system\'s p_fpops I end up at almost 160 hours. The WU\'s I have running, seem to need about 125 hours each on my \"old\" C2D.

                                                              Currently 2 WU\'s running, having already spent 2.5 CPU-days together (or about 1000 point for BOINC). I sure hope these things finish before crashing. Wasting CPU resources is NOT the reason I\'m participating.

                                                              If they ever do finish, it\'ll probably take very long before these WU\'s get verified by 3 users... (some of them will crash, be re-issued etc). :(

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                                                              Message 7314 - Posted 17 Sep 2008 18:33:32 UTC - in response to Message 7311.

                                                                Last modified: 17 Sep 2008 18:37:21 UTC

                                                                16/09/2008 17:41:21|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_2005b03a-31dd-43b4-af28-075ebb4be9a8_783_2: exceeded CPU time limit 340640.410044


                                                                Are you telling me these work units are going to bomb out after 94.5 hours (~340k seconds) regardless? I\'ve got two running which are going to take closer to 250 hours to complete as they are...

                                                                Who knows? Maybe Ádám have a clue? This one was computed on C2D E4400@3.1GHz.

                                                                Right now some of another units processed on Celeron 430@2.1GHz are on 97.8%@74:08; 97.4%@95:38; 95.0%@55:35; 94.4%@78:20; 87.3%@108:15; 79.5%@32:39; 58.199%@65:37; 56.599%@49:19; 45.7%@71:10; 31.7%@68:56; 31.7%@53:07; 25.7%@11:24; 25.4%@36:23; 20.9%@46:55 completed. And so on...

                                                                There are 4 completed WU - 111,426.38; 108,222.55; 16,313.19; 125,530.23 seconds and 418.13; 380.94; 34.60; 470.65 claimed credit respectively.

                                                                Anyway - such time variations is too big for normal work speaking about another projects and their deadline.
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                                                                Message 7315 - Posted 17 Sep 2008 19:44:58 UTC

                                                                  I edited my client_state file to increase the values of <rsc_fpops_est> and <rsc_fpops_bound> for the result I have in progress. And I think it helped. After some trial and error, I wound up with a value of <rsc_fpops_est> that was about 40 times its original value. After the change, my \"CPU time\" + \"To completion\" time is now pretty close to agreeing with the total time projected by the \"Progress\" meter. I also increased <rsc_fpops_bound> by a similar amount (and it\'s probably higher now than necessary).

                                                                  I had made adjustments like these (with help) on SETI Beta several months ago when Astropulse units were having similar problems. And it worked there. So it may be worth a try here. Just make sure you have made a back-up copy of your BOINC folder before starting. And shut BOINC down while you are editing.
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                                                                  Message 7316 - Posted 17 Sep 2008 20:07:46 UTC - in response to Message 7315.

                                                                    I edited my client_state file to increase the values of <rsc_fpops_est> and <rsc_fpops_bound> for the result I have in progress. And I think it helped. After some trial and error, I wound up with a value of <rsc_fpops_est> that was about 40 times its original value. After the change, my \"CPU time\" + \"To completion\" time is now pretty close to agreeing with the total time projected by the \"Progress\" meter. I also increased <rsc_fpops_bound> by a similar amount (and it\'s probably higher now than necessary).

                                                                    I had made adjustments like these (with help) on SETI Beta several months ago when Astropulse units were having similar problems. And it worked there. So it may be worth a try here. Just make sure you have made a back-up copy of your BOINC folder before starting. And shut BOINC down while you are editing.


                                                                    I wondered about doing something similar - and then realised that unless at least two other people do it with the same work unit I\'ll just end up with the only finished copy and still get nothing for it!

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                                                                    Message 7317 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 7:16:24 UTC - in response to Message 7288.

                                                                      Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 7:17:36 UTC

                                                                      Hi Everyone,

                                                                      due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                                      However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.

                                                                      ==Adam


                                                                      ADAM, since most all the WU\'s that my fleet got stated between 8 and 22 minutes duration, and the settings I had set for the project were for keeping enough work for .1 days, my PC\'s were getting 6-10 WU\'s each. And with a deadline of the 23rd of September for most of them I was not even going to be close, as most all the WU\'s given out since the 6th have been HUGE time eaters. If this is going to be the norm, YOU need to set a realistic limitation on your work generation and distribution settings. I have aborted all WU\'s that had not already started, and NNW the PC\'s until I see that you have made adjustments to your systems. It was not fair to the other projects I crunch for.

                                                                      Thank you and good luck.

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                                                                      Message 7318 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 9:21:19 UTC

                                                                        Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 9:24:03 UTC

                                                                        My 2.3-GHz Mac G5 has got through a couple of tasks in 57-58 hours. The two it’s crunching now are 76% done in 21 h and 37% done in 85.5 h. I’ve already aborted about a hundred, but it still appears that this host has downloaded far more work than it can handle.

                                                                        These WUs seem to have 1000 lines; any chance of reducing that? Or are the calculations not independent? I’m particularly concerned about the skip-to-the-next-line-when-interrupted bug: it would be a shame to have a result representing 250 CPU-hours of crunching fail to validate because of one incomplete line …

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                                                                        Message 7319 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 14:29:38 UTC

                                                                          Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 14:34:45 UTC

                                                                          Ouch ... does an interrupted result always produce that error?

                                                                          That crappy ancient BOINC bug hit this result yesterday, when a DNS resolution fails (ISP trouble), the core client gets stuck, sometimes for several minutes, producing those unnecessary \"heartbeat\" failures.


                                                                          (the first restart was my own decision, in order to increase the fpops limit)

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                                                                          Message 7320 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 14:46:54 UTC - in response to Message 7319.

                                                                            Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 14:48:52 UTC

                                                                            Ouch ... does an interrupted result always produce that error?

                                                                            That crappy ancient BOINC bug hit this result yesterday, when a DNS resolution fails (ISP trouble), the core client gets stuck, sometimes for several minutes, producing those unnecessary \"heartbeat\" failures.


                                                                            (the first restart was my own decision, in order to increase the fpops limit)

                                                                            Hint: Boinc V6 doen\'t lock up as badly (releases faster) on internet failures. Makes it easier to suspend network activity.

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                                                                            Message 7321 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 15:20:42 UTC

                                                                              Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 15:28:56 UTC

                                                                              Finished my first WU 2 days ago ~105 hr. DCF went from .2 to 100. Second WU now at 103 hr @ 46.9%. The revised completion time was 76 hr. It has taken over one of my cores and will just make due date. It will probably double my DCF unless there is a cap on it. I\'ve temporarily set this project to NNT and aborted the rest of the ~80 WU I originally received.

                                                                              I\'ve un-suspended the rest of my projects, but I already had a couple WU in my cache from another project that are likely to need to go high priority to make their deadlines before this second WU get finished. This whole situation has really made of mess of Boinc scheduling but it will eventually straighten itself out. I doubt my system will ask for more work from this project for several weeks as it works though the LTD (long term debt) it is still building up.
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                                                                              Message 7322 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 16:02:38 UTC - in response to Message 7319.

                                                                                Last modified: 18 Sep 2008 16:07:20 UTC

                                                                                Ouch ... does an interrupted result always produce that error?


                                                                                If you are talking about the old (and imfamous) \"Output is empty\" problem, it\'s my opinion that occurence of this type of error was drastically reduced by v2.06. But, because the recent dimension 12 WU\'s were a lot shorter in duration (and thus the time spent on each line was a lot shorter), the opportunity for the problem to occur was very small. That is, this problem seemed to be related to mid-line checkpoints which sometimes (but not always) caused a jump ahead to the next line after a reboot. End-of-line checkpoints (written immediately after the Progress meter jumps ahead by a discrete amount) are OK. There were a lot of postings about this issue (back when it was a causing a lot of errors) but I don\'t believe Adam ever gave us an adequate response. In other words, don\'t be surprised if the problem crops up again on these dimension 13 WU\'s. Best advice, if you have to shut BOINC down and you can control when it happens, force SZTAKI to run and then wait for the next jump in the Progress meter before exiting. That way, you will have a good end-of-line checkpoint to resume with.


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                                                                                Message 7323 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 19:05:24 UTC - in response to Message 7320.

                                                                                  Hint: Boinc V6 doen\'t lock up as badly (releases faster) on internet failures. Makes it easier to suspend network activity.

                                                                                  In the Mac versions at least, there was drastic improvement in that regard somewhere between v5.4.x and v5.10.x. IME the earlier versions of BOINC Manager would become completely unresponsive when opened or brought to the foreground during a network outage, requiring a Force Quit and relaunch, but the later v5 clients don’t seem to get tripped up. (I haven’t yet tried v6 on any of my hosts.)

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                                                                                  Message 7324 - Posted 18 Sep 2008 19:11:50 UTC

                                                                                    I asked my ISP to wait for the end of a line before crashing the DNS server ;-)

                                                                                    BOINC 6 (i.e. BOINC Vista) seems not to be so desirable for other reasons. I like to keep control over a program - a simple \"unzip\" installer should do for a program like BOINC and it should stay in the place where I want it to be, not making excessive use of the registry, leaving system directories completely alone.

                                                                                    A program that creates additional users, directories outside of its home and wants to make me behave in this or that way - stuff like that I have enough at work, don\'t need it for my boxes at home that run nothing but DC projects.

                                                                                    Thanks for the informations, I guess I\'ll have to pause this project for another few months until this problem is fixed. I will finish the WU that I\'m just working on though.

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                                                                                    Message 7326 - Posted 19 Sep 2008 4:57:23 UTC - in response to Message 7324.

                                                                                      I asked my ISP to wait for the end of a line before crashing the DNS server ;-)

                                                                                      BOINC 6 (i.e. BOINC Vista) seems not to be so desirable for other reasons. I like to keep control over a program - a simple \"unzip\" installer should do for a program like BOINC and it should stay in the place where I want it to be, not making excessive use of the registry, leaving system directories completely alone.

                                                                                      A program that creates additional users, directories outside of its home and wants to make me behave in this or that way - stuff like that I have enough at work, don\'t need it for my boxes at home that run nothing but DC projects.

                                                                                      Thanks for the informations, I guess I\'ll have to pause this project for another few months until this problem is fixed. I will finish the WU that I\'m just working on though.

                                                                                      The purpose of running Boinc 6 in a limited user account is security. Since Boinc developer have no control over who can set up a project, sandboxing it limits the damage a rogue project can do. Can you just imagine the resulting bad press for the entire Boinc community, if a project was found to have been set up that could mine the users personal information or in some way could take control of the user system for its own purpose. I personally prefer that they make Boinc as secure as they can.
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                                                                                      Message 7327 - Posted 19 Sep 2008 6:09:33 UTC

                                                                                        Last modified: 19 Sep 2008 6:13:57 UTC

                                                                                        All fine with me as long as it is optional - and it can and should be the default. I did understand the intention for organizing it in this new way.

                                                                                        A plain .zip file, all core client options (directories, users if needed) in a configuration file as an optional(!) \"on your own risk\" distribution would be my distribution though. I\'m old (and experienced) enough to take care for myself :-)


                                                                                        p.s.: And of course I will not blame anyone but myself if I would fall on a malicious project, that\'s understood.

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                                                                                        Message 7330 - Posted 20 Sep 2008 1:16:52 UTC - in response to Message 7327.

                                                                                          Last modified: 20 Sep 2008 1:20:17 UTC

                                                                                          BOINC for Mac OS X has had its own “sandbox” for a while, since v5.8.x IIRC.

                                                                                          p.s.: And of course I will not blame anyone but myself if I would fall on a malicious project, that\'s understood.

                                                                                          Fair enough, but you have no control over journalists, bloggers, and whoever else might try and start a panic over an incident involving intrusion via BOINC. Even without an actual rogue project, once known vulnerabilities get into the rumour mill, before long “it could happen” often becomes “it happened to a friend of a friend” … so it’s only prudent to take some simple precautions.

                                                                                          I do think it’s a bit silly that BOINC asks to be reinstalled whenever it needs to access a file it doesn’t own (separately downloaded apps &c.); IME all that’s required is to tell the system to apply the enclosing folder’s permissions to all of its contents and relaunch. Very easy on a Mac; I can’t imagine it being difficult in any other modern OS.

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                                                                                          Message 7332 - Posted 20 Sep 2008 13:47:44 UTC

                                                                                            Last modified: 20 Sep 2008 14:17:15 UTC

                                                                                            Oh great! My second WU crapped out with error -177 (0xffffff4f) resource limit exceeded. The result page doesn\'t even show it had crunched more than 100 hrs. Last I checked it was will still only ~60% done.

                                                                                            At least it frees up my second core so nothing else is going to have deadline problems. I\'m not expecting to see any work from SZTAKI for at least a month as the other projects collect on the over 100 hrs of debt they built up.

                                                                                            edit: I just checked on my wingman for the first WU. He crunches for twice as many projects as I do. It\'s a 64 X2 Mobile and from his various project RAC, I doubt he can even come close to making deadline on these WUs. I wonder if I\'ll ever get to see the 1460 credit for my completed WU. Oh well, I guess that\'s part of the fun of BOINCING.
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                                                                                            Message 7333 - Posted 20 Sep 2008 23:10:51 UTC - in response to Message 7288.

                                                                                              Hi Everyone,

                                                                                              due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                                                              However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.

                                                                                              ==Adam


                                                                                              Hi Adam,

                                                                                              I have ~ 200 WUs on 16 Hosts. Since there is no way they will finish before the deadline, wouldn\'t it be better to extend the deadline rather that re-issue them. They are runnng over 100 hours which it will still take that long if re-issued.

                                                                                              If the deadline is reached and the server re-issues them, will it also cancel the ones left in hosts or will we have to abort them on our end?

                                                                                              Thanks

                                                                                              Bill

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                                                                                              Message 7334 - Posted 21 Sep 2008 0:07:13 UTC - in response to Message 7333.

                                                                                                If the deadline is reached and the server re-issues them, will it also cancel the ones left in hosts or will we have to abort them on our end?

                                                                                                The servers will continue to accept tasks that have passed their deadlines until the work-unit reaches quorum and the validator accepts the results. So there’s often a good chance for late tasks to receive credit, especially when a large proportion of crunchers are having trouble meeting the deadlines. Before aborting a task in which my host had invested any time, I’d look up the WU to evaluate the likelihood that at least three of my quorum partners will return results before I can.

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                                                                                                Message 7335 - Posted 21 Sep 2008 9:24:25 UTC

                                                                                                  Last modified: 21 Sep 2008 10:16:46 UTC

                                                                                                  Two hours ago, after 140+ hours of computation, this task gave the following message:
                                                                                                  21/09/2008 08:29:37|SZTAKI Desktop Grid|Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_17b47bf7-0cca-4f15-985f-1fc72bc82dae_7597_0: exceeded CPU time limit 503486.258965
                                                                                                  I spotted it before it uploaded and noted that, for some unknown reason, the \'CPU Time\' displayed had dropped from over 140 hours to 46:15:40!!

                                                                                                  I\'m going to set this project to NNW for a while as it doesn\'t seem likely that anyone is going to have any success with the work currently available.

                                                                                                  [Edit]Unsurprisingly, the second task has now done the exact same thing. :(

                                                                                                  Can anyone explain why the cpu time is being reduced upon error?[/edit]

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                                                                                                  Message 7338 - Posted 22 Sep 2008 6:18:59 UTC

                                                                                                    CPU time limit exceeded:
                                                                                                    what a frustration having spent more than 350 hours of CPU time on two WU\'s and not getting any results.
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                                                                                                    Message 7339 - Posted 22 Sep 2008 8:08:59 UTC - in response to Message 7338.

                                                                                                      CPU time limit exceeded:
                                                                                                      what a frustration having spent more than 350 hours of CPU time on two WU\'s and not getting any results.


                                                                                                      I\'m going to guess that you also had the problem I spotted, as when I look at your results they show less than 5000 seconds of (combined) CPU time.

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                                                                                                      Message 7348 - Posted 22 Sep 2008 18:10:45 UTC

                                                                                                        I have just got CPU time exceeded:
                                                                                                        Computer Host Project Date ID Message
                                                                                                        D021 CP708-ITS-D021 SZTAKI Desktop Grid 9/20/2008 5:11:44 PM 226 Aborting task 37ab002f-ee81-4a23-853c-cbed64362d16_1cc3e340-4ac3-44ec-9db7-aae2b45d81b4_1892_1: exceeded CPU time limit 384429.619143


                                                                                                        Result Id: 8184183

                                                                                                        I currently have No New Work set; but with a long term duration of -205,000, it will be awhile before I get anything, anyways.
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                                                                                                        Message 7349 - Posted 22 Sep 2008 18:35:19 UTC - in response to Message 7348.

                                                                                                          I currently have No New Work set


                                                                                                          However, looking on the bright side, I did manage to get a WU finished on an old 2.4G P4!

                                                                                                          http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2235786

                                                                                                          382K seconds - Got to be an easy win for my wingmen with better hardware. Go wingnuts, go! ;)

                                                                                                          Al.

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                                                                                                          Message 7350 - Posted 22 Sep 2008 22:23:04 UTC

                                                                                                            I just got back from a week long business trip to chicago to find 1 WU ran 168 hours but only 73% finished on my old 1 GHz machine. I aborted it and the 20 - 30 others in queue as they\'ll all miss their deadlines. And the others showed only 18 minutes to run. Now I have several other small projects that will miss their deadlines too...

                                                                                                            There\'s certainly something amiss in the 13th - and I was born on the 13th!
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                                                                                                            Message 7353 - Posted 23 Sep 2008 8:59:06 UTC

                                                                                                              Last modified: 23 Sep 2008 9:00:18 UTC

                                                                                                              My G5 just got through a long task: 189 hours. It barely made the deadline—not that it matters, as there have already been three Compute Errors on the WU, so it’ll probably be a quite a while before it’s ready for the validator …

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                                                                                                              Message 7355 - Posted 24 Sep 2008 2:02:44 UTC

                                                                                                                Last modified: 24 Sep 2008 2:05:52 UTC

                                                                                                                This result finished a little while ago. Although it missed its deadline by a few hours, it was the first successful result for the WU. And I believe it avoided a Maximum CPU Time Exceeded error because I had increased the values of <rsc_fpops_est> and <rsc_fpops_bound> (as reported earlier here).
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                                                                                                                Message 7356 - Posted 24 Sep 2008 5:10:35 UTC

                                                                                                                  I must say that it is EXTREMELY disappointing that Adam gives a simple, irreverent response to a major problem on here 10 days ago. Then we are all getting completely blown off!! All the while, this project has completely screwed up all of my other projects running under Boinc, stealing way too much time, with way too short deadlines. All we get is some flippant, uncaring answer, saying that it is hard to compute...

                                                                                                                  I don\'t think that a little respect from the admins & management is too much to ask. I have tried time & time again to keep this project running, in spite of its problems. I have done this mainly because I really wanted my CPU power used for something Mathematics related. But sadly, I guess it is time to cut my losses and find a project where the admins & mgmt have respect for the people donating their cpu time & resources.
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                                                                                                                  Message 7357 - Posted 24 Sep 2008 11:45:51 UTC

                                                                                                                    Some days ago my Quad Q6600 has finished processing 3 WU (I\'ve aborted others), only one of which was finished correctly for 25 hours with pending credit. Other two have given out errors, each after approximately 100 hours of calculation... It is really very sad. :(

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                                                                                                                    Message 7358 - Posted 24 Sep 2008 14:50:23 UTC

                                                                                                                      I have to agree with everyone who\'s asking for extended deadlines.

                                                                                                                      There are some of us who are still running collectible old Pentium III\'s, who can\'t possibly make deadline on some of these workunits. I have one going now on one of my P-III 700\'s that\'s projected to run something like 588 hours. (Ouch!) I\'ll let it run regardless, since two other wingmen have aborted it. But, I shouldn\'t have to hope that my wingmen will abort in order for me to get credit.
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                                                                                                                      Message 7362 - Posted 24 Sep 2008 23:19:57 UTC - in response to Message 7358.

                                                                                                                        I have to agree with everyone who\'s asking for extended deadlines.

                                                                                                                        There are some of us who are still running collectible old Pentium III\'s, who can\'t possibly make deadline on some of these workunits. I have one going now on one of my P-III 700\'s that\'s projected to run something like 588 hours. (Ouch!) I\'ll let it run regardless, since two other wingmen have aborted it. But, I shouldn\'t have to hope that my wingmen will abort in order for me to get credit.
                                                                                                                        Mine P-III now at 57,299% in 241:18. )) Deadline was sept. 23, 23:55, but I\'ll let it run too.

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                                                                                                                        Message 7366 - Posted 25 Sep 2008 1:56:11 UTC - in response to Message 7356.

                                                                                                                          Last modified: 25 Sep 2008 2:08:07 UTC

                                                                                                                          [...] this project has completely screwed up all of my other projects running under Boinc, stealing way too much time, with way too short deadlines.

                                                                                                                          BOINC keeps track of any extra time taken by the project while it tries to meet the deadlines and, when it gets a chance, will honour your chosen resource shares by giving the other projects more CPU-time until the “debt” is repaid.

                                                                                                                          To those who are worrying about deadlines, my advice is not to. Unless a late task is the fourth or later successfully returned for its WU it will still be accepted. A BOINC deadline is not an expiry date: its passing just means the server won’t wait for that particular result. If the server is still waiting for a quorum to be reached, the deadlines are irrelevant. Again, I recommend to all thinking about aborting tasks, especially those already under way, that you have a look at your WUs to evaluate the likelihood that they’ll get to the validator before your result comes in. I expect you\'ll find, in most cases, that at least one of your “wingmen” has also missed the deadline, experienced an error, or aborted.

                                                                                                                          P.S. My G5 has submitted five tasks whose deadline was yesterday. Only one has a second successful result in the same WU: all the others (93% of this small sample!) are errors or late. And as I write this none of the replacement tasks has yet been sent out.

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                                                                                                                          Message 7368 - Posted 25 Sep 2008 7:52:54 UTC

                                                                                                                            Hi, I\'ve aborted all my tasks except two, which are at 17% and 11% right now, respectively. I\'d like to complete these two tasks but I fear I might fall victim to the infamous \"Maximum CPU Time Exceeded\" error. I\'ve read about client_state.xml, rsc_fpops_est and rsc_fpops_bound, and have been watching these values the last couple of days. However, these values have not changed since I started watching them. So how do I know when it is time to increase rsc_fpops_bound, and by how much? Thank you!

                                                                                                                            Stick
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                                                                                                                            Message 7369 - Posted 25 Sep 2008 12:15:31 UTC - in response to Message 7368.

                                                                                                                              Last modified: 25 Sep 2008 12:26:57 UTC

                                                                                                                              Hi, I\'ve aborted all my tasks except two, which are at 17% and 11% right now, respectively. I\'d like to complete these two tasks but I fear I might fall victim to the infamous \"Maximum CPU Time Exceeded\" error. I\'ve read about client_state.xml, rsc_fpops_est and rsc_fpops_bound, and have been watching these values the last couple of days. However, these values have not changed since I started watching them. So how do I know when it is time to increase rsc_fpops_bound, and by how much? Thank you!


                                                                                                                              The values came as part of the WU and do not change unless you edit them. But, the client_state file is read every time BOINC is started up - so you should edit the file when BOINC is shutdown and the new values will be used when you restart BOINC. (And, before doing anything like this, always make a back-up copy of your BOINC folder.)

                                                                                                                              As to what values to use, this is what worked for me. Divide current \"CPU time\" by current \"Progress\" percent complete. That will give you an estimate of the total time BOINC will take to process the result. Then divide that number by the initial \"To completion\" for the unit (use your best guess). When I did it, the number I got was between 35 and 40. Then multiply your initial rsc_fpops_est by that number. And edit your rsc_fpops_bound so that it is (significantly) higher than the new rsc_fpops_est. If you did it correctly, when you restart BOINC, \"To completion\" should now be a reasonable estimate of the actual time needed to finish. (And, if your original rsc_fpops_bound was smaller than your new rsc_fpops_est, you can be assured that you would have gotten the infamous \"Maximum CPU Time Exceeded\" error if you hadn\'t made the changes.)

                                                                                                                              EDIT: I was off by an order of magnitude. The factor I used was actually between 350 and 400.

                                                                                                                              ____________

                                                                                                                              adrianxw
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                                                                                                                              Message 7370 - Posted 25 Sep 2008 16:28:17 UTC

                                                                                                                                Last modified: 25 Sep 2008 16:30:51 UTC

                                                                                                                                WU 102 hours and 57%, wingmen dropping away. I\'m cutting my loss here and NNW\'ing.

                                                                                                                                *** EDIT ***

                                                                                                                                When I aborted it, the 102 hours dropped to 86 hours...
                                                                                                                                ____________
                                                                                                                                Wave upon wave of demented avengers march cheerfully out of obscurity into the dream.

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                                                                                                                                Message 7380 - Posted 26 Sep 2008 7:24:39 UTC - in response to Message 7369.

                                                                                                                                  Hi, I\'ve aborted all my tasks except two, which are at 17% and 11% right now, respectively. I\'d like to complete these two tasks but I fear I might fall victim to the infamous \"Maximum CPU Time Exceeded\" error. I\'ve read about client_state.xml, rsc_fpops_est and rsc_fpops_bound, and have been watching these values the last couple of days. However, these values have not changed since I started watching them. So how do I know when it is time to increase rsc_fpops_bound, and by how much? Thank you!


                                                                                                                                  The values came as part of the WU and do not change unless you edit them. But, the client_state file is read every time BOINC is started up - so you should edit the file when BOINC is shutdown and the new values will be used when you restart BOINC. (And, before doing anything like this, always make a back-up copy of your BOINC folder.)

                                                                                                                                  As to what values to use, this is what worked for me. Divide current \"CPU time\" by current \"Progress\" percent complete. That will give you an estimate of the total time BOINC will take to process the result. Then divide that number by the initial \"To completion\" for the unit (use your best guess). When I did it, the number I got was between 35 and 40. Then multiply your initial rsc_fpops_est by that number. And edit your rsc_fpops_bound so that it is (significantly) higher than the new rsc_fpops_est. If you did it correctly, when you restart BOINC, \"To completion\" should now be a reasonable estimate of the actual time needed to finish. (And, if your original rsc_fpops_bound was smaller than your new rsc_fpops_est, you can be assured that you would have gotten the infamous \"Maximum CPU Time Exceeded\" error if you hadn\'t made the changes.)

                                                                                                                                  EDIT: I was off by an order of magnitude. The factor I used was actually between 350 and 400.


                                                                                                                                  Thank you. I did the calculation and ended up with a factor of about 2500. This means 300 hours of total CPU time required. Oh well...

                                                                                                                                  The_Bad_Penguin
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                                                                                                                                  Message 7386 - Posted 28 Sep 2008 1:30:06 UTC

                                                                                                                                    new to this project, got one unit due 10/2, about 60 hrs into it, ~30% done.

                                                                                                                                    should i attempt to finish, or cut my loses and go to another project while they fix stuff around here?

                                                                                                                                    Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                    Message 7387 - Posted 28 Sep 2008 7:46:47 UTC - in response to Message 7386.

                                                                                                                                      new to this project, got one unit due 10/2, about 60 hrs into it, ~30% done.
                                                                                                                                      should i attempt to finish, or cut my loses and go to another project while they fix stuff around here?

                                                                                                                                      Two of the initial tasks from that WU were aborted, and the replacements are still unsent. So it’s unlikely that missing the deadline by a few days will be a problem. OTOH it could also be a while before you get credit …

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                                                                                                                                      Message 7390 - Posted 29 Sep 2008 3:56:03 UTC

                                                                                                                                        I´m still waiting for my credits LOL
                                                                                                                                        Have a look: http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2228657

                                                                                                                                        It´s been the longest chrunching of a WU.
                                                                                                                                        ____________

                                                                                                                                        The_Bad_Penguin
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                                                                                                                                        Message 7391 - Posted 29 Sep 2008 7:17:03 UTC - in response to Message 7387.

                                                                                                                                          thanx, more worried about wu crashing after reaching deadline, than about credit.

                                                                                                                                          as long as something meaningful can come from this wu, i will let it continue... it\'s over 80 hours now, and says 56% done.



                                                                                                                                          new to this project, got one unit due 10/2, about 60 hrs into it, ~30% done.
                                                                                                                                          should i attempt to finish, or cut my loses and go to another project while they fix stuff around here?

                                                                                                                                          Two of the initial tasks from that WU were aborted, and the replacements are still unsent. So it’s unlikely that missing the deadline by a few days will be a problem. OTOH it could also be a while before you get credit …


                                                                                                                                          Stick
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                                                                                                                                          Message 7394 - Posted 29 Sep 2008 12:37:33 UTC - in response to Message 7391.

                                                                                                                                            Since you are \"letting it continue\", be sure to read the posts here about Maximum CPU Time Exceeded errors and editing/increasing <rsc_fpops_est> and <rsc_fpops_bound>.



                                                                                                                                            thanx, more worried about wu crashing after reaching deadline, than about credit.

                                                                                                                                            as long as something meaningful can come from this wu, i will let it continue... it\'s over 80 hours now, and says 56% done.


                                                                                                                                            ____________

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                                                                                                                                            Message 7396 - Posted 29 Sep 2008 22:35:48 UTC - in response to Message 7394.

                                                                                                                                              Since you are \"letting it continue\", be sure to read the posts here about Maximum CPU Time Exceeded errors and editing/increasing <rsc_fpops_est> and <rsc_fpops_bound>.

                                                                                                                                              My G4/400 is in pretty deep and, just as luck and Murphy’s Law would have it, the WU it’s crunching has two successful results showing, making it something of a horserace.

                                                                                                                                              But the danger of timing out appears slight at this point: about 318 hours in, it’s over 35% done, and dividing the 10^15 maximum fpops by its 267-Mflops benchmark yields well over 1000 h, while it looks like the task should be done in around 900 h.

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                                                                                                                                              Message 7407 - Posted 3 Oct 2008 20:28:47 UTC - in response to Message 7396.

                                                                                                                                                Last modified: 3 Oct 2008 20:32:24 UTC

                                                                                                                                                My G4/400 is in pretty deep and, just as luck and Murphy’s Law would have it, the WU it’s crunching has two successful results showing, making it something of a horserace.

                                                                                                                                                But the danger of timing out appears slight at this point: about 318 hours in, it’s over 35% done, and dividing the 10^15 maximum fpops by its 267-Mflops benchmark yields well over 1000 h, while it looks like the task should be done in around 900 h.

                                                                                                                                                My PIII@651 has finally finished his WU! \"Only\" 10 days overdue. *Sigh*

                                                                                                                                                But it\'s credited! 1,491,988.33 sec CPU time (414h26m28s), 1300 credit granted.

                                                                                                                                                I wonder about three new replacements of this WU, which were sent today. Will they be credited also?

                                                                                                                                                I think admins must radically increase a deadline and decrease WU quota (queue) to one WU per CPU at the same time.
                                                                                                                                                ____________

                                                                                                                                                Stick
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                                                                                                                                                Message 7408 - Posted 3 Oct 2008 23:50:57 UTC - in response to Message 7407.

                                                                                                                                                  Last modified: 3 Oct 2008 23:53:42 UTC

                                                                                                                                                  I wonder about three new replacements of this WU, which were sent today. Will they be credited also?


                                                                                                                                                  If BOINC contacts the server again before starting one of these replacements, the replacement should be be cancelled with a \"Didn\'t need\" message. But, if a replacement is already underway, it will be allowed to finish and (if valid) receive credit, as long as it is returned before its deadline.
                                                                                                                                                  ____________

                                                                                                                                                  Frank & Stein
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                                                                                                                                                  Message 7414 - Posted 7 Oct 2008 1:58:25 UTC

                                                                                                                                                    It\'s been nearly a month since I started this thread, and I must say that I\'m disappointed with the (lack of) developments since then. I have indeed completed a fair number of units, and one even reached a quorum. Many others are languishing, awaiting for some other brave souls to surrender sufficient CPU time.

                                                                                                                                                    The unit duration has varied by nearly 10:1 from longest to shortest, and that only counts the ones that finished without reaching the dreaded -177 (0xffffff4f) \"maximum CPU time exceeded\" error.

                                                                                                                                                    While others may wish to delve into the assorted arcane BOINC settings to stave off such events, I have neither the patience nor inclination to screw around on my end to make this application work.

                                                                                                                                                    Four days into this thread, the admin responded with a plea to forge ahead. I have done so, but with no sign of improvement I will do so no longer. This project will continue to rack up \"No New Work\" users, detached users, and frustrated participants until positive changes occur.

                                                                                                                                                    I appreciate the difficulties that may exist in solving the issues, but I choose not to share in those difficulties when there are plenty of other stable, and worthy projects. Best of luck to the admin and the project. I hope you get this solved. Until then, adios.

                                                                                                                                                    Profile [B^S] Astral Walker
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                                                                                                                                                    Message 7415 - Posted 7 Oct 2008 14:16:53 UTC - in response to Message 7414.

                                                                                                                                                      I had the same problem as most, downloading WUs with an estimate of 5 minutes when the actual is more like 100+ hours depending on the hardware. This is the exact opposite of what the WUs used to be like and I have to say I wish we were downloading 200 hour WUs that only took 5 minutes to run. So I\'ve been NNW, allowing 1 WU at a time for the most part to see how things would go when the estimated times were about on par.

                                                                                                                                                      The problem, at least for me, is that BOINC just doesn\'t know what to do with such erratic WUs. I\'ve let my cache drop down dramatically and let it fill back up and I am now sitting on a WU that\'s been crunching for 87.5 hours and says it is 60.4% done. The problem is that it says it has about 70 horus to go and the deadline is tomorrow. BOINC gave up on the WU several days ago and refuses to run it anymore.

                                                                                                                                                      The issue is that BOINC initially thinks it can complete the WU but the estimated completion times are so unpredictable that eventually it can get to the point where BOINC runs it until realizing the WU can\'t be completed by the deadline anymore and gives up, wasting enormous amounts of cpu time. Extending the deadline would be great but unless the deadline on my WU actually changes it won\'t help. Have they extended the deadlines on new WUs? If they haven\'t even made that step then I\'ll be NNW for a while.

                                                                                                                                                      Ultimately the admins here have to take responsibility for making sure that the estimated times for these WUs can be met by BOINC I saw a post here saying they\'ll do something and that was what, 3 weeks ago? The times don\'t have to be accurate but they need to be set in some way that BOINC will finish the WUs by the deadline.
                                                                                                                                                      ____________

                                                                                                                                                      paperdragon
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                                                                                                                                                      Message 7416 - Posted 7 Oct 2008 15:56:48 UTC

                                                                                                                                                        I was just looking at the work units \"max # of error/total/success results\"; which is set at 6/10/6.

                                                                                                                                                        The above means that the system will sent out the work unit a maxium of 10 times. It does a first send of 4 work units. If all those go beyond the time, 4 more will go out in 2 weeks. And two weesk after that if 3 more go out, the exceeded 10 max work units will cause the system to error the entire workunit out.

                                                                                                                                                        So in a minnium of 6 weeks we could start getting works units being errored out, and all credits being cancelled. So these short deadlines are going to become a system problem fairly soon, I think, as the work units are cancelled because of too many being sent.

                                                                                                                                                        So for those of us pushing through this mess, it may mostly be for nought. And overall for the project, likely this diminsion will have to be redone with proper deadlines.
                                                                                                                                                        ____________

                                                                                                                                                        http://boinc-wiki.ath.cx/index.php?title=Main_Page

                                                                                                                                                        Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                                        Message 7418 - Posted 9 Oct 2008 2:39:49 UTC - in response to Message 7415.

                                                                                                                                                          The problem, at least for me, is that BOINC just doesn\'t know what to do with such erratic WUs. I\'ve let my cache drop down dramatically and let it fill back up and I am now sitting on a WU that\'s been crunching for 87.5 hours and says it is 60.4% done. The problem is that it says it has about 70 horus to go and the deadline is tomorrow. BOINC gave up on the WU several days ago and refuses to run it anymore.

                                                                                                                                                          That’s very strange: BOINC normally runs late tasks at high priority—my G4 mentioned upthread has deferred all its work from other projects in favour of its SDG task that was due a fortnight ago. Are you sure you didn’t suspend either the task or the project? What version of BOINC are you running? Are there any relevant messages in the log?

                                                                                                                                                          Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                          Message 7421 - Posted 9 Oct 2008 14:22:37 UTC

                                                                                                                                                            Last modified: 9 Oct 2008 14:24:52 UTC

                                                                                                                                                            I got four of these monster workunits on one of my dual-Pentium III 700 machines. Three of the four finished, two on time and one a few days late. The fourth one had run for around 550 hours, and only had a few hours left to completion. (It was due to finish some time today.) This morning, it crashed with a \"CPU time exceeded\" error.

                                                                                                                                                            Deadlines need to be increased and this \"CPU time exceeded\" non-sense needs to be removed. Also, perhaps a bit more internal testing should be done before releasing a new run of workunits into the wild.
                                                                                                                                                            ____________

                                                                                                                                                            Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                            Message 7425 - Posted 10 Oct 2008 18:57:00 UTC

                                                                                                                                                              Last modified: 10 Oct 2008 18:57:28 UTC

                                                                                                                                                              For curiosity, and for the first time in ages, I allowed some Sztaki workunits to download to my Quad-core Extreme machine. I just wanted to see how fast it could crunch these new monster workunits.

                                                                                                                                                              I only wanted to download a few workunits, but I got 50! Even on this 3.0 Gigahertz Penryn-class machine, some of the workunits in progress are projected to run anywhere from 90 to 123 hours.

                                                                                                                                                              So, even with this machine, there\'s no way that I\'ll be able to meet the deadline for most of the workunits.
                                                                                                                                                              ____________

                                                                                                                                                              Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                                              Message 7426 - Posted 11 Oct 2008 2:34:58 UTC - in response to Message 7425.

                                                                                                                                                                I only wanted to download a few workunits, but I got 50!

                                                                                                                                                                That’s because they come with running-time estimates that are low by two to three orders of magnitude. It only takes one completed task for BOINC to adjust its reckoning—but a new host will take the estimates at face value, and one that was last here a few weeks or months ago, when the tasks were short, will also greatly overestimate its capacity for the current work until it’s acquired some experience.

                                                                                                                                                                Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                Message 7434 - Posted 15 Oct 2008 12:07:21 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                  A few days after I downloaded those 50 monster workunits, I got the bright idea of looking to see which ones had already been completed by two wingmen. I found four, and suspended work on all but those four, and the four that were already in progress. That way, I figured, I\'d be giving priority to workunits for which I could actually get credit. (And, it would make my wingmen happy, since they\'d also finally get some credit.)

                                                                                                                                                                  The first of those finished during the night. But, as my luck would have it, my two wingmen got gobs of credit, and I got a big fat zero.

                                                                                                                                                                  If I remember correctly, we had this problem once before. But, I thought that it had gotten corrected. Anyway, here\'s the workunit for anyone who\'d like to take a look.

                                                                                                                                                                  Workunit with zero credits
                                                                                                                                                                  ____________

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                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7435 - Posted 15 Oct 2008 14:50:44 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                    I got 0 credit because the system says there were too many results! It sent out the unit to 11 machines, though 11 haven\'t all replied. Nonetheless the program thinks it has more than allowed.

                                                                                                                                                                    Who programs this stuff?

                                                                                                                                                                    http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2227480

                                                                                                                                                                    Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7436 - Posted 15 Oct 2008 17:05:51 UTC - in response to Message 7435.

                                                                                                                                                                      Last modified: 15 Oct 2008 17:06:36 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                      I got 0 credit because the system says there were too many results! It sent out the unit to 11 machines, though 11 haven\'t all replied. Nonetheless the program thinks it has more than allowed.

                                                                                                                                                                      Who programs this stuff?

                                                                                                                                                                      http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2227480



                                                                                                                                                                      Yeah, I see what you mean. The workunits are only allowed to be re-sent ten times, and you just happened to be number 11. (Which begs the question, why was it even sent an eleventh time?)

                                                                                                                                                                      Mine didn\'t even have that problem. It validated for the two wingmen okay and got Cobblestones for them, but got zero for me.
                                                                                                                                                                      ____________

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                                                                                                                                                                      Message 7437 - Posted 15 Oct 2008 20:18:12 UTC - in response to Message 7434.

                                                                                                                                                                        If I remember correctly, we had this problem once before. But, I thought that it had gotten corrected. Anyway, here\'s the workunit for anyone who\'d like to take a look.

                                                                                                                                                                        Workunit with zero credits


                                                                                                                                                                        Don,

                                                                                                                                                                        This does sound like the old problem - your \"zero\" is Linux and the other two were Windows. I don\'t know if it will do any good, but I sent an e-mail to Adam about it (just in case he isn\'t reading the boards very often).

                                                                                                                                                                        Stick

                                                                                                                                                                        ____________

                                                                                                                                                                        Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                        Message 7438 - Posted 15 Oct 2008 22:40:56 UTC - in response to Message 7437.

                                                                                                                                                                          If I remember correctly, we had this problem once before. But, I thought that it had gotten corrected. Anyway, here\'s the workunit for anyone who\'d like to take a look.

                                                                                                                                                                          Workunit with zero credits


                                                                                                                                                                          Don,

                                                                                                                                                                          This does sound like the old problem - your \"zero\" is Linux and the other two were Windows. I don\'t know if it will do any good, but I sent an e-mail to Adam about it (just in case he isn\'t reading the boards very often).

                                                                                                                                                                          Stick


                                                                                                                                                                          Thanks, I appreciate it.
                                                                                                                                                                          ____________

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                                                                                                                                                                          Message 7439 - Posted 16 Oct 2008 0:31:16 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                            At last my G4/400 has finished its task in 2.15 million seconds, a good three weeks late—but since the replacements hadn’t come back yet (two of them had already reached “No reply” status)—it received full credit (nearly a thousand CS).

                                                                                                                                                                            Almost 25 days of CPU-time: is that a record?

                                                                                                                                                                            BTW, I suspect that someone who’s posted here recently included a link (in a sig?) that requires a password: I’m getting authentication dialogs from www.userbars.org whenever I open this thread. This wasn’t happening as of my last posting here, on the 11th inst. Not much to be done about it now, I guess, but whoever it was: please don’t do it again!

                                                                                                                                                                            Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                            Message 7441 - Posted 16 Oct 2008 13:15:59 UTC - in response to Message 7439.

                                                                                                                                                                              At last my G4/400 has finished its task in 2.15 million seconds, a good three weeks late—but since the replacements hadn’t come back yet (two of them had already reached “No reply” status)—it received full credit (nearly a thousand CS).

                                                                                                                                                                              Almost 25 days of CPU-time: is that a record?

                                                                                                                                                                              BTW, I suspect that someone who’s posted here recently included a link (in a sig?) that requires a password: I’m getting authentication dialogs from www.userbars.org whenever I open this thread. This wasn’t happening as of my last posting here, on the 11th inst. Not much to be done about it now, I guess, but whoever it was: please don’t do it again!




                                                                                                                                                                              Yeah, I\'m getting that userbars.org thing, too. It is quite annoying.
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                                                                                                                                                                              Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                              Message 7442 - Posted 16 Oct 2008 13:19:25 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                Well, I\'ve just successfully finished a workunit for which I\'ll never receive credit. This time, the workunit went into \"too many results\" mode while I still had it in progress. So, I\'ve now gone through the entire list, looking for \"too many\" results workunits so that I could abort all of them.

                                                                                                                                                                                I usually don\'t complain, but too much more of this and I\'ll have to abandon the project for a while.
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                                                                                                                                                                                Message 7443 - Posted 16 Oct 2008 13:33:39 UTC - in response to Message 7434.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Last modified: 16 Oct 2008 13:35:37 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                  The first of those finished during the night. But, as my luck would have it, my two wingmen got gobs of credit, and I got a big fat zero.

                                                                                                                                                                                  If I remember correctly, we had this problem once before. But, I thought that it had gotten corrected. Anyway, here\'s the workunit for anyone who\'d like to take a look.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Workunit with zero credits

                                                                                                                                                                                  Alas, I have one such WU too.

                                                                                                                                                                                  It was more than month since Adam\'s last responce here. Nothing changed at all. Things going to get even worse. :(

                                                                                                                                                                                  Who need this wasting computer power and what for? Definitely, I am not. Well, admins completely ignore us, so I\'ll reply the same way.

                                                                                                                                                                                  Hasta la vista, SZTAKI. Maybe, next time.

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                                                                                                                                                                                  Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7446 - Posted 17 Oct 2008 1:56:07 UTC - in response to Message 7442.

                                                                                                                                                                                    I usually don\'t complain, but too much more of this and I\'ll have to abandon the project for a while.

                                                                                                                                                                                    My hosts racked up enough debt, in dealing with their initial batches of WUs, that they won’t be asking for more work from SDG “for a while” anyway! The G4/400 almost certainly won’t be contacting SDG again this year. AIU the BOINC scheduler, each week of running high-priority (on all available CPUs) with a resource share of e.g. 10% will be followed by a pause of e.g. 9 weeks.

                                                                                                                                                                                    hape
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                                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7448 - Posted 19 Oct 2008 9:45:00 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                      I just had another \"CPU time exceeded\" error, this after roughly 120 hours of CPU time - what a waste!

                                                                                                                                                                                      Since the trouble started about a month ago (same time as this tread started) nothing has improved. We are still getting lot\'s WU running much longer than shown first and finally stopping without result with CPU time exceeded.

                                                                                                                                                                                      I stop Stzaki on my PC\'s and do more useful work in other projects.
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                                                                                                                                                                                      Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                                      Message 7449 - Posted 19 Oct 2008 14:40:44 UTC - in response to Message 7448.

                                                                                                                                                                                        I just had another \"CPU time exceeded\" error, this after roughly 120 hours of CPU time - what a waste!

                                                                                                                                                                                        Since the trouble started about a month ago (same time as this tread started) nothing has improved. We are still getting lot\'s WU running much longer than shown first and finally stopping without result with CPU time exceeded.

                                                                                                                                                                                        I stop Stzaki on my PC\'s and do more useful work in other projects.



                                                                                                                                                                                        I\'ve received one \"CPU time exceeded\" error on one of my old Pentium III\'s, with only a few hours left until the workunit would have completed. My main problem now, though, is that I keep completing workunits for which I receive no credit. I\'ve done a few that that got zero Cobblestones due to it having too many results. I\'ve also had a few that validated for both my wingmen and me, but I received zero Cobblestones due to the fact that I\'m running Linux, and my wingmen were running Windows.

                                                                                                                                                                                        So, I\'ll try to finish a few more workunits before they expire on the 23rd, and then I\'ll abort the rest and switch back to Einstein at Home.
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                                                                                                                                                                                        KAMCOBILL
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                                                                                                                                                                                        Message 7452 - Posted 21 Oct 2008 4:40:40 UTC - in response to Message 7334.

                                                                                                                                                                                          If the deadline is reached and the server re-issues them, will it also cancel the ones left in hosts or will we have to abort them on our end?

                                                                                                                                                                                          The servers will continue to accept tasks that have passed their deadlines until the work-unit reaches quorum and the validator accepts the results. So there�s often a good chance for late tasks to receive credit, especially when a large proportion of crunchers are having trouble meeting the deadlines. Before aborting a task in which my host had invested any time, I�d look up the WU to evaluate the likelihood that at least three of my quorum partners will return results before I can.



                                                                                                                                                                                          Hi Odysseus,

                                                                                                                                                                                          I had one host where the last WU took almost 200 hours and others were between 100 and 200. But when the new WUs came in the estimated time to complete was 3 hours and all 7 are a week late according to time to complete. I\'ve been manually running WUs so as to not make other Projects WUS be past deadline.

                                                                                                                                                                                          My questiong is can something be done to force the time to finish to 200-300 hours when received from server? FreeHAL@Home\'s WUs are coming in at 6000+ hours to complete, but they really don\'t take that long. :-) If this were done, most WUs wouldn\'t interfer with the other project\'s WUs and there would be a lot more happy crunchers out there. :D

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                                                                                                                                                                                          DigiK-oz
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                                                                                                                                                                                          Message 7454 - Posted 21 Oct 2008 14:22:17 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                            Last modified: 21 Oct 2008 14:22:56 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                            Apparently, finishing a WU does not guarantee credit. I have one of them long-running WU\'s finished. My wingman didn\'t finish, so it got re-issued. And re-issued again...Still no-one else finished the WU, and now my finished WU shows ZERO points.

                                                                                                                                                                                            http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2225501

                                                                                                                                                                                            That\'s it for me. With a non-responsive admin on a project with issues like the ones in this thread, this project is a no-go for me. And I definitely will advise others likewise. Too bad.....


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                                                                                                                                                                                            Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                                                                            Message 7456 - Posted 22 Oct 2008 1:02:40 UTC - in response to Message 7452.

                                                                                                                                                                                              I\'ve been manually running WUs so as to not make other Projects WUS be past deadline.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Yuck. I suggest aborting any SDG tasks you haven’t started yet (or have invested little time in, so far)—and you might consider doing the same for other projects as well (and setting them to NNT until you’ve caught up). Just to reduce the amount of micromanaging required … note also that interrupted SDG tasks sometimes come up invalid.

                                                                                                                                                                                              My questiong is can something be done to force the time to finish to 200-300 hours when received from server?

                                                                                                                                                                                              AIUI the running-time estimates for a given host are based on its DCF, which only gets updated when a task is completed. Once BOINC has made it through a long task, you should see the time-to-completion figures increasing by more than an order of magnitude.

                                                                                                                                                                                              Odysseus
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                                                                                                                                                                                              Message 7457 - Posted 22 Oct 2008 1:06:25 UTC - in response to Message 7454.

                                                                                                                                                                                                Apparently, finishing a WU does not guarantee credit. I have one of them long-running WU\'s finished. My wingman didn\'t finish, so it got re-issued. And re-issued again...Still no-one else finished the WU, and now my finished WU shows ZERO points.

                                                                                                                                                                                                http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2225501

                                                                                                                                                                                                The dreaded “too many errors / total results”—evidently the limits of 6 & 10 are too low for the situation. I should think it would have been only prudent to increase these figures for the initial issue of WUs of a new type—with the proverbial “20/20 hindsight”—unfortunately they can’t be changed retroactively.

                                                                                                                                                                                                My 2.3-GHz G5 spent 189 hours on a task from WU Nº2225344, which appears to be destined for the same outcome. Among others mentioned recently here IIRC …

                                                                                                                                                                                                On similar occasions in the past, Ádám has ‘manually’ granted credit for successful results; maybe he’ll take pity on us again.

                                                                                                                                                                                                @Ádám: Please? If you’re still here … and thank you. ;)

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                                                                                                                                                                                                Message 7459 - Posted 22 Oct 2008 10:36:04 UTC - in response to Message 7457.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  Last modified: 22 Oct 2008 10:38:18 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                  On similar occasions in the past, Ádám has ‘manually’ granted credit for successful results; maybe he’ll take pity on us again.

                                                                                                                                                                                                  @Ádám: Please? If you’re still here … and thank you. ;)

                                                                                                                                                                                                  IMHO no chance.
                                                                                                                                                                                                  Ádám is absent (maybe hiding :)) and many of WU (like the one I mention in my previous post) already purged off the database.
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                                                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7460 - Posted 22 Oct 2008 15:08:24 UTC - in response to Message 7418.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    Last modified: 22 Oct 2008 15:11:39 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                    The problem, at least for me, is that BOINC just doesn\'t know what to do with such erratic WUs. I\'ve let my cache drop down dramatically and let it fill back up and I am now sitting on a WU that\'s been crunching for 87.5 hours and says it is 60.4% done. The problem is that it says it has about 70 horus to go and the deadline is tomorrow. BOINC gave up on the WU several days ago and refuses to run it anymore.

                                                                                                                                                                                                    That’s very strange: BOINC normally runs late tasks at high priority—my G4 mentioned upthread has deferred all its work from other projects in favour of its SDG task that was due a fortnight ago. Are you sure you didn’t suspend either the task or the project? What version of BOINC are you running? Are there any relevant messages in the log?


                                                                                                                                                                                                    Apparently, not if BOINC determines it can\'t finish the WU by the deadline. I was using version 5.10.45 I believe. And no the project was not suspended as I tried to suspend other projects to get the WUs to run but that was a mistake as loads of new WUs kept pouring in. :p
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                                                                                                                                                                                                    ai5000
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                                                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7462 - Posted 23 Oct 2008 1:06:05 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last modified: 23 Oct 2008 1:07:14 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                      http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2226504
                                                                                                                                                                                                      Thanks for wasting my time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                      Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                                                      Message 7463 - Posted 23 Oct 2008 15:47:12 UTC - in response to Message 7462.

                                                                                                                                                                                                        Last modified: 23 Oct 2008 15:47:50 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                        http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2226504
                                                                                                                                                                                                        Thanks for wasting my time.



                                                                                                                                                                                                        Same here.

                                                                                                                                                                                                        Anyway, I won\'t be participating anymore in this project for a while. At least not until some of the problems get resolved.
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                                                                                                                                                                                                        Aurora Borealis
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                                                                                                                                                                                                        Message 7464 - Posted 23 Oct 2008 17:10:51 UTC - in response to Message 7460.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Last modified: 23 Oct 2008 17:33:09 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                          The problem, at least for me, is that BOINC just doesn\'t know what to do with such erratic WUs. I\'ve let my cache drop down dramatically and let it fill back up and I am now sitting on a WU that\'s been crunching for 87.5 hours and says it is 60.4% done. The problem is that it says it has about 70 horus to go and the deadline is tomorrow. BOINC gave up on the WU several days ago and refuses to run it anymore.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          That’s very strange: BOINC normally runs late tasks at high priority—my G4 mentioned upthread has deferred all its work from other projects in favour of its SDG task that was due a fortnight ago. Are you sure you didn’t suspend either the task or the project? What version of BOINC are you running? Are there any relevant messages in the log?


                                                                                                                                                                                                          Apparently, not if BOINC determines it can\'t finish the WU by the deadline. I was using version 5.10.45 I believe. And no the project was not suspended as I tried to suspend other projects to get the WU\'s to run but that was a mistake as loads of new WU\'s kept pouring in. :p

                                                                                                                                                                                                          That would be normal as Boinc tries to refill the cache when other WU are suspended. Because of the short estimated time on this project, depending on the size of your cache you could end up with 100\'s of WU. The trick is to set all your projects including this one to NNT before suspending the other projects.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          Anyway, I\'m working on my third giant WU. It\'s heading for over 140 hrs and I suspect it will error out like the last one. I only succeeded to complete one WU so far and I doubt I even get credit for that one since it has already been aborted by 3 others and there are 3 no replies. It is likely to be rejected as having too many user errors.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          If this last WU errors out, I\'m going to have to suspend working for this project altogether until Adam gets his act together and cleans up this mess. I\'ve already wasted some 400 hrs of computer time on this useless work. I have other project that at the moment are more deserving of my CPU\'s time and this project is unfortunately now going to be set for a much small percentage of my resource share in the future even when things are fixed.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          It shouldn\'t have to take this long for the project to bite the bullet, abort all work, run a script to give credits for work completed and reset all the parameters before reissuing these WU\'s so as not to waste the volunteers time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                          I don\'t mind spending 150 hrs doing a WU as long as it provides usable results.
                                                                                                                                                                                                          ____________
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                                                                                                                                                                                                          Darren Young
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                                                                                                                                                                                                          Message 7465 - Posted 23 Oct 2008 18:13:42 UTC - in response to Message 7456.


                                                                                                                                                                                                            Yuck. I suggest aborting any SDG tasks you haven’t started yet (or have invested little time in, so far)—and you might consider doing the same for other projects as well (and setting them to NNT until you’ve caught up). Just to reduce the amount of micromanaging required … note also that interrupted SDG tasks sometimes come up invalid.

                                                                                                                                                                                                            I aborted 14 tasks from this PC. I will have to check the other 6 computers that I have running SDG.
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                                                                                                                                                                                                            Stick
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                                                                                                                                                                                                            Message 7466 - Posted 23 Oct 2008 21:01:06 UTC - in response to Message 7464.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              Anyway, I\'m working on my third giant WU. It\'s heading for over 140 hrs and I suspect it will error out like the last one. I only succeeded to complete one WU so far and I doubt I even get credit for that one since it has already been aborted by 3 others and there are 3 no replies. It is likely to be rejected as having too many user errors.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              If this last WU errors out, I\'m going to have to suspend working for this project altogether until Adam gets his act together and cleans up this mess. I\'ve already wasted some 400 hrs of computer time on this useless work. I have other project that at the moment are more deserving of my CPU\'s time and this project is unfortunately now going to be set for a much small percentage of my resource share in the future even when things are fixed.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              It shouldn\'t have to take this long for the project to bite the bullet, abort all work, run a script to give credits for work completed and reset all the parameters before reissuing these WU\'s so as not to waste the volunteers time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                              I don\'t mind spending 150 hrs doing a WU as long as it provides usable results.


                                                                                                                                                                                                              You can avoid Max CPU Time errors by editing your client_state file (as described here) - might be worth a shot if you already have a lot of time invested in a WU. But, as far as know, we can\'t do anything about the \"too many results\" problem.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                              reklov
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                                                                                                                                                                                                              Message 7468 - Posted 24 Oct 2008 19:43:14 UTC - in response to Message 7466.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                But, as far as know, we can\'t do anything about the \"too many results\" problem.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                You ought to reduce the maximum daily WU quota per CPU and restrict it to 1/day until the problems are resolved. At least the number of \"no reply\" and user aborted WUs would thereby reduced. As a consequence, the probability to fullfill the quorum would rise.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                                Message 7469 - Posted 24 Oct 2008 20:38:16 UTC - in response to Message 7468.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                  But, as far as I know, we can\'t do anything about the \"too many results\" problem.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                  You ought to reduce the maximum daily WU quota per CPU and restrict it to 1/day until the problems are resolved. At least the number of \"no reply\" and user aborted WUs would thereby reduced. As a consequence, the probability to fullfill the quorum would rise.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Agreed. But that would require an admin to do it; and, we haven\'t heard from one of them in a long long time.


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                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Aurora Borealis
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7470 - Posted 25 Oct 2008 3:03:56 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Last modified: 25 Oct 2008 3:15:44 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Completed my 3rd WU successfully along with 3 other people. The problem is the WU has been marked as \'too many errors\', so no one gets any credits and we each wasted ~140 hrs of CPU time.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I\'ve scandered over 400 hrs in computer time. I am now suspending this project until the admins get their act together. I\'ll not be wasting any more of my computer\'s resources here.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                    ____________
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7473 - Posted 26 Oct 2008 21:04:56 UTC - in response to Message 7288.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last modified: 26 Oct 2008 21:11:07 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Hi Everyone,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Not even sure why I posted, since ADAM the LAZY admin has not made a post on his projects message boards for over 30 days.. WHAT GIVES!!!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Come on Adam, respond- your project is starting to get some bad press in the BOINC world.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                      ==Adam




                                                                                                                                                                                                                      What do you intend to do with all the WU\'s that abort on exceeded time estimate.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I have had several abort during the past couple of days - all of these have run for over 70-100 hours. So far, this is a terrific use of my computers time!!!!


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                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Profile David Saum
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Message 7483 - Posted 31 Oct 2008 17:27:51 UTC - in response to Message 7473.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        [quote]Hi Everyone,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Not even sure why I posted, since ADAM the LAZY admin has not made a post on his projects message boards for over 30 days.. WHAT GIVES!!!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Come on Adam, respond- your project is starting to get some bad press in the BOINC world.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        ==Adam


                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Today I have a wu that has run 355 hrs on an Athlon 3400 for 46% with an estimated 191 hrs remaining and it was due 10/29/08. It does not appear that I am getting any credit for running previous wu like this, and they have captured my Boinc queue as a high priority job. Why should I waste my time like this nonsense??

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Message 7485 - Posted 31 Oct 2008 22:43:33 UTC - in response to Message 7483.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          [quote]Hi Everyone,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          due to the characteristics of the application it is hard to predict the running times of the workunits. Some will finish quick, some will take some time. However, the workunits - no matter how long they take to finish - are useful for the project and they are not defective. Please let your computer finish as much as it can, before the deadlines. Those which remain unprocessed after the reach of the deadline will be taken care by the server and will be sent out once more with a new deadline.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          However, it is a problem that too many workunits gets sent out. I\'m working on a solution for this.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Not even sure why I posted, since ADAM the LAZY admin has not made a post on his projects message boards for over 30 days.. WHAT GIVES!!!

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Come on Adam, respond- your project is starting to get some bad press in the BOINC world.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          ==Adam


                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Today I have a wu that has run 355 hrs on an Athlon 3400 for 46% with an estimated 191 hrs remaining and it was due 10/29/08. It does not appear that I am getting any credit for running previous wu like this, and they have captured my Boinc queue as a high priority job. Why should I waste my time like this nonsense??



                                                                                                                                                                                                                          If I\'m looking at the correct one, it\'s already gone into a \"too many results\" error. So, even if you finish you won\'t get any credit. The best thing you can do is just to abort this one.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                          ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Gilles Dorion
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Message 7487 - Posted 1 Nov 2008 4:22:10 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Just to add one more to this long list.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/result.php?resultid=8414929

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            GD
                                                                                                                                                                                                                            ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Profile m.mitch
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Message 7501 - Posted 4 Nov 2008 10:55:44 UTC - in response to Message 7485.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              If I\'m looking at the correct one, it\'s already gone into a \"too many results\" error. So, even if you finish you won\'t get any credit. The best thing you can do is just to abort this one.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                              That\'s what\'s happening, many with two pending results too. Some even have a third result but still get canned. See work unit 2227060. This is becoming very disappointing.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Adam needs to increase the work unit time to 400+ hours. I\'m running 20+ projects and it stuffs them up too. I\'ve lost several million seconds of work that could have returned 1,000\'s of credits in Milky Way.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                              ____________


                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Click here to join the #1 Aussie Alliance on SZTAKI

                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Profile kadam
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Message 7502 - Posted 4 Nov 2008 14:02:49 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Hi,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                sorry for the late reply, but it took me some time to investigate the situation. The thing is that it\'s rather hard to determine the optimal WU size, since this new dimension seems to fluctuate on a wider scale than previous dimensions used to be. Working on the solution...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                ==Adam
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                ____________
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                If you like BOINC, you may also find CaretCursor to be appealing.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Message 7503 - Posted 4 Nov 2008 15:48:02 UTC - in response to Message 7502.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Hi,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  sorry for the late reply, but it took me some time to investigate the situation. The thing is that it\'s rather hard to determine the optimal WU size, since this new dimension seems to fluctuate on a wider scale than previous dimensions used to be. Working on the solution...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  ==Adam



                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Adam,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I know that with aborted WU (exceeded time) there is not credit - but many participants have asked if this can be corrected.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Can you run a script to grant credit for those WU\'s

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  If you need some help with the application, I know of several people that have been doing optimizations and code enhancements for several projects and I am sure they would not oppose to helping out here.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Just send me a PM and I can see if I can get them in touch with you.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  In the mean time- is there a way to increase the estimated time to finish to something like 300 hours?? Some projects have done this in the past and it has worked out quite well.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Thanks for your reply!



                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Profile [AF>France>TDM>Centre]Jeannot Le Tazon
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7505 - Posted 4 Nov 2008 22:15:10 UTC - in response to Message 7503.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Adam,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    could you take a look at the pending credits too ?

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Thanks a lot!



                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    ai5000
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7506 - Posted 5 Nov 2008 7:40:00 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Last modified: 5 Nov 2008 7:41:58 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Any hope for tasks that granted 0 credit but have already been deleted?
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Like this one:
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/workunit.php?wuid=2226504

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Donald A. Tevault
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      Message 7517 - Posted 9 Nov 2008 19:03:18 UTC - in response to Message 7502.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Hi,

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        sorry for the late reply, but it took me some time to investigate the situation. The thing is that it\'s rather hard to determine the optimal WU size, since this new dimension seems to fluctuate on a wider scale than previous dimensions used to be. Working on the solution...

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        ==Adam



                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Until you get this figured out, could you take the interim measures of extending the deadlines, and changing the \"6, 10, 6\" \"error/total/success results\" to something more reasonable? Say, something like \"20, 20, 20\"?
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        salogel
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                        Message 7521 - Posted 10 Nov 2008 13:58:12 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Last modified: 10 Nov 2008 13:59:51 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Hi,
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Why are there results with granted 0 credit and claimed about 800 although there is no error or abortion and they finished within time?
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          like these two:
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          8347748
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          8347751

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Regards
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          legolas13
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          ____________

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Alexander
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                          Message 7527 - Posted 12 Nov 2008 10:05:54 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            News

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Nov 11. 2008
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Longer stop due to maintenance.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Yeah, and all my results are gone. I hope that\'s only temporary.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Profile ChertseyAl
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            Message 7528 - Posted 12 Nov 2008 20:04:48 UTC - in response to Message 7527.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              News

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Nov 11. 2008
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Longer stop due to maintenance.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Yeah, and all my results are gone. I hope that\'s only temporary.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              The descriptors of the workunits that are currently being processed have been lost during the maintenance. We kindly ask to abort any workunits that has been downloaded before the 12th of november. New workunits, with extended report deadline and shorter processing times will be available soon. We apoligize for any inconvinience caused. Users who are involved in the problem will be granted credit for their work

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Any chance of the many workunits completed over a month ago getting resolved? The resends of these units never happened, leaving lots of work hung with 1 or 2 results awaiting a third result that could never happen.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              It would be tragic to throw away so much CPU time just because an IT problem.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Al.

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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                              Message 7551 - Posted 17 Nov 2008 14:54:59 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                I dropped the Sztaki project. Currently I get tasks which are running about 1010 hours.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                1100 hours. So, I decided to run other projects.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Eric
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                Message 7556 - Posted 17 Nov 2008 22:51:00 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  I am in 2 minds whether to drop this project or not. I have lost over 11,000 credits for the last month because of not getting results validated. There are people out there who lost a greater amount than I did.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  At present I am looking at the length of the work units. 1000 hrs seems excessive. At present they appear to be an over estimation of required run time. Should this continue then I may well keep this project going. I am hoping that any I.T. problems are being resolved. The next few weeks should be interesting.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Eric......

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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  Message 7558 - Posted 18 Nov 2008 15:27:48 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Last modified: 18 Nov 2008 16:21:51 UTC

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I think is is probably safe to start processing SZTAKI WU again as the project estimates and run times seem to have been corrected.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I\'ve completed my first WU from the new batch. Boinc displayed a completion time of 1300+ hrs but it finished in a little over 5 hrs.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The reason for the Boinc overestimation of the completion time is that my DCF (Duration Correction Factor) was pushed up to 103 because of the previous grossly underestimated WU\'s. After finishing the WU my DCF has been reduced to 100. This is what would be expected if the project now has its completion time estimate in the right ballpark.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The normal DCF is usually less than 1 for newer computers on most projects. Boinc bumps the DCF up quickly when a WU is underestimated by the project but adjusts it back down very slowly after processing a WU with better project completion time estimates.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    If you feel comfortable editing your Boinc files you can manually adjust the DCF. This is not for the faint of heart. Be careful, do not to make any other changes to the file as it contains most of the information Boinc needs about your projects.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Exit Boinc making sure all the processing has stopped. Open the client_state.xml file for editing using a text editor like notepad, edit the DCF line then Save (NOT Save as) the file. Restart Boinc.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The client_state.xml file is located in the in Boinc Data folder for Boinc 6. It\'s in the Boinc folder for older Boinc versions.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Look for the section
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    <project>
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    <master_url>http://szdg.lpds.sztaki.hu/szdg/</master_url>
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    <project_name>SZTAKI Desktop Grid</project_name>

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The line to be edited is will look something like
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    <duration_correction_factor>103.000000</duration_correction_factor>
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    The actual number will be different on your system.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Edit the 103 to 1 so that it looks like
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    <duration_correction_factor>1.000000</duration_correction_factor>
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Save file.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Boinc should now display a more reasonable completion time estimates when restarted. Boinc will continue to fine tune the DCF and displayed completion times as more work is completed.
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    ____________
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Questions? Answers are in the BOINC Wiki.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Boinc V6.6.0 Test
                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    WinXP C2D 2.1G 4GB

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Darren Young
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                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    Message 7568 - Posted 19 Nov 2008 19:02:27 UTC - in response to Message 7558.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I think is is probably safe to start processing SZTAKI WU again as the project estimates and run times seem to have been corrected.


                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      I only had 7 PC\'s on this project, but I think I will wait a while.

                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                      A lot of cpu time was wasted on this project with little input from the project admins.


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